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 gary
(@gary)
New Member
Joined: 13 years ago
Posts: 2
April 21, 1999 6:40 am  

i wish this war would just STOP.


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(@jenny_christina_)
New Member
Joined: 21 years ago
Posts: 4
April 21, 1999 6:43 am  

Hello. Maby I dont wrigt so well in englesh but I was born in War II and nobady want to lives like we did. I learn of my family to love and forgives.
Wen I was 15 I was rep (an Turkish man rep me) but I cant hate all from turkey. I born a child from this man and I rise my child to love. You in amerika havent democrati (what are you doing whit indians, black peopel, puertoricanos, and many more). Say me one country in this world how havent problems. If you want to accept 1 grup of teroist/gerila you need to accept them all. PLO; IRA; ETA; KURDS; TAMILI for an exampel. You dont (I hope) wat you are talkin about. I cant exept that NATO pleys polic in the world wen they dont have democratia in they on homelands. (country). If you want to see what happend to take 40% fron Nato;s explenation and 40 % from Serbian sids an 10 % from your heart then you make a picur.
Jenny.


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(@emina)
Reputable Member
Joined: 13 years ago
Posts: 441
April 21, 1999 6:54 am  

TO MAJA.

You are very good telling on lets say your neighbouring countries history.Especially negative part of a countries history.Tell me can you be so honest about Slovenia?And can you also be so honest about Serbia.Or are those two countries perfect.
If you can't or won't i will do it for you.

And once more i suggested to try and look at the future you obviously can't pitty.

Another you say you are almost ashamed of being partly Croat, but what do young German people feel then?
Ill tell you they admit the horrible mistakes and history of their country, but the same time Germany has recovered well and their proud again.
You know why?
Ill tell you they could let go of history and look at the bright new days infront of them.Knowing they where no part of it, and noone has the right to think that they are.
Same goes for croats now.

Emina


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(@emina)
Reputable Member
Joined: 13 years ago
Posts: 441
April 21, 1999 6:58 am  

TO MAJA.
I agree that children in the US should not have weapons ,but you really think if he(Clinton) takes away the arms of the American youth it will stop the Serbian Army and police from killing.
I have to admit it would be a unique solution.

Emina


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(@emina)
Reputable Member
Joined: 13 years ago
Posts: 441
April 21, 1999 7:05 am  

TO JACK.

Yes i came here as a refugee, i did not have to stay in a AZC cause of my twinsister living in Holland already.Thank god.
I will tell you the whole story by e mail its too personal to put it here.I dont want people butchering me again.
Yes i got your mail strange though , cause i sent two messages.

Emina.

Ps tell me a time to meet at the other board?


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(@emina)
Reputable Member
Joined: 13 years ago
Posts: 441
April 21, 1999 7:10 am  

TO JACK.
Now your wondering if i am a lady?
Yes i am.
If you look at my language structure the name vojvodina is also female can can explain a bit of grammer to you if you like?

Emina


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(@guido)
Estimable Member
Joined: 21 years ago
Posts: 137
April 21, 1999 8:51 am  

MAJA,
If the good students and teachers in the USA were allowed to carry concealed weapons they could have stopped the crazy ones before they killed 15 of their peers. If the citizens of Yugoslavia were allowed to have weapons, someone would have shot Milosevic 10 years ago!

P.S. Did you go to Kosovo and see for yourself?


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 maja
(@maja)
Reputable Member
Joined: 21 years ago
Posts: 303
April 21, 1999 10:11 am  

Mate, why don't you tell why the war in Croatia started? It wasn't started by Milosevic but by Craina Serbs, who the same as Albanians in Kosovo, were taken all the rights. And they didn't want to live in the country where they are not considered even a minority.

Guido, refugees were not used as a human shields, atleast not those who were bombed. They themselves said there was no police or army in sight when they were hit.

I am were happy and have to congratulate England. They have taken 200 refugees and are prepared to take few more??? Macedonia is obviously not taking anymore till the Nato countries take some out.

Oh yeah, and I have seen the tape of how French army men are beaten up by Macedonian peasents and were running like crazy.


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 maja
(@maja)
Reputable Member
Joined: 21 years ago
Posts: 303
April 21, 1999 11:07 am  

This NATO breefings have become a live comedy.
After first denying they have destroyed the cigarette factory in Nis, what obviously could not be denied general Morana stated that cigarette factory was a military target. Journalists were puzzled, of course, asking since when are cigarettes used in the battle. He than said the cigarette factory was making arms. Oh please.


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 mate
(@mate)
New Member
Joined: 13 years ago
Posts: 4
April 21, 1999 1:06 pm  

Maja,

War starts when the 1st organized armed aggression occurs. There was rhetoric back and forth between Serb, Croat, Muslim, and Slovenian sides. Rhetoric is one thing, but the application of violence, synchronized by Serb paramilitaries and the JNA, was the first catalyst to total war. This is how the war started.

Do you remember Pakrac, Vukovar, Plitvice, Borovo Selo? Do you understand that Serbia inherited the JNA, the 3rd or 4th largest conventional army in Europe at the time? Croatia had no military to speak of whatsoever. Many Serbian politicians were saying at the time that history provided an opportunity for expansion at Croatia's sake.

We had no armor, no artillery, no engineering, no air force. What could we threaten the people of Serbia with? How?

Let the academic arm chair pundits discuss the so called causes of the war. For people of common sense, we recognize war when a group of people initiate armed aggression. Serbians supported the gamble and you ultimately lost. Milosevic ultimately set the conditions for the defeat of innocent Serbs in Croatia.

Serbia is doing the same in Kosovo. Why cannot good people of Serbia even consider that Serb Army is committing military actions with no sense of discrimination or proportionality? How does suppossed KLA few terrorist actions justify the expulsion of all Albanians. The Albanians, unlike Croatia's Serbs, never waged a massive war of conquest and killing.

Sorry, you will lose this one like the rest. I pray that the Serbian nation can redeem itself. We too in Croatia have to do so, but at least we took the 1st step in starting the debate of WW II and the Ustasa. Maybe we are more fortunate in that it was long ago and beyond most living memory. It probably must be awful hard to deal with the present.

Mir i postovanje...


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 ad1
(@ad1)
New Member
Joined: 21 years ago
Posts: 3
April 21, 1999 1:21 pm  

US DOJ vs NATO
by: KurdoP (37/M/nz)
2262 of 2268
Article by Pedro Kurdo (business corespondent, Internet Express News)

It would be a good idea to take note about the events that are taking place in the background of the current crisis in Yugoslavia. This can have great consequences
on the way some organisations will have to conduct their business, now and in the near future.


Just recently we learned that US Department Of Justice (US DOJ) commenced an action against NATO alliance under Section 2 of the Sherman Act for
unlawfully gaining its monopoly in the market of terrorist activities.
As US DOJ put it "NATO is engaged in unfair business practices and anticompetitive agreements directed at gaining total monopoly in the terrorist business."
According to US DOJ, "Carrying illegal attacks on Afghanistan, Somalia and now Yugoslavia, NATO is trying to use backdoor entry to the market, and with all its
financial and technological might to push out numerous, small and often independent terrorist groups out of the spotlight."

"We clearly feel threatened", says Osama bin Laden, managing director of a relatively small but well-established terrorist group. "They have all the technology and
know-how to carry out mass murder and destruction on a scale we can only dream of. They have a superior infrastructure and propaganda machine required for
getting away with this sort of business. This market has to be regulated as soon as possible." (Terrorist Digest, April 99)

But architect of NATO's new policies Madeleine Albright vigorously defends their position "It's a nonsense. Stating that NATO is engaged in unfair practices is just
an attempt to put blame on somebody else, which is not uncommon in this sort of business. They have to take a better look into their effectiveness and, if necessary,
restructure in the most critical areas of their activities."

Analysts say that, though the marked is still not saturated a sudden arrival of such a powerful organisation into the world, for a long time dominated by small,
ethnically and religiously organised businesses, has sent shockwaves throughout the industry.

Another prominent terrorist leader, who wanted to remain anonymous, accused NATO of "dumping" practices, without a doubt another new tactic in the market.
"They are ready to invest enormous amounts of time and money in killing and destruction without getting any political profit from it," he said. "You don't have to be a
guided missile scientist to figure out the motifs".
What he finds especially disturbing is the use of the latest generation humanoid remote-controlled robots of "Solana" type for public relation exercises. "You can
always say, after things start to go wrong, that you didn't want it or you didn't mean it, and put all the blame on a brainless dummy", he complains. "and that will give
them enormous advantage by keeping the core of the organisation with all the decision-makers invisible for prosecution."

James Rubin, a prominent advocate of NATO's involvement in terrorist business finds the whole case "misplaced". "We love to compete, and more so, we support
competition", he replies passionately. "If our unconditional support for KLA does not illustrate our commitment for small terrorist organisations I don't know what
does."

But many industry watchers dispute the idea of NATO's commitment for small subversive organisations, and find it just a cover for achieving the organisation's
goals.

The terrorist business is definitely not what it used to be. It has institutionalised and moved mainstream. Like it or not, NATO is here to stay, one way or the other,
for a long time to come.


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 jack
(@jack)
Active Member
Joined: 21 years ago
Posts: 18
April 21, 1999 2:27 pm  

Maja, Cigarettes do kill.


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 jack
(@jack)
Active Member
Joined: 21 years ago
Posts: 18
April 21, 1999 2:53 pm  

Emina,

Nope - I don't question your gender.
But your language structure and sequence of thought
reveals more than just your gender.
It gives away your age and experience.
Same as Maja's give away her lack of both.


GUIDO
Welcome back.
Great analogy:
"You can't reason with a blind cobra!
All you can do is stomp it's head
until it does'nt move anymore!"
It is as simple as that.
I love animals just as I love peace.
But even birth - the act of GIVING life -
is not without pain.
It is not a contradiction to say
that we have to fight for peace.

MAJA
Will you invite us to the graduation ceremonies?
The ceasefire in Kosovo is around the corner
and I think we should be downscaling hostilities as well.
Let's talk about the future.
Yesterday is gone.
Do you have a scenario for Kosovo/Serbia for the next 2 months?


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 maja
(@maja)
Reputable Member
Joined: 21 years ago
Posts: 303
April 21, 1999 4:07 pm  

Guido, I have no scenarios for the future but one fact, more innocent people will die. Today NATo managed to kill ten refugees in the refugee camp. Since Emina is a refugee herself, she should know it is not nice to escape from the one war zone to be killed.
Mate, the Serb situation in Craina was the same as the Albanian situation in Kosovo. Why do you think Serbs should give the same rights to Albanians that your country refused to give to Serbs? Why didn't you give Serbs the autonomy? Then maybe there would be war in Croatia. Are you saying that Tudman ustasi regim had good intentions for Serbs?
Arms or no arms, you would have finished them all.
Even though NDH and ustasi were supposed to be only history, as you say, when Croatia became an indeŇ°endant country, ustasi and NDH ideas were very well alive. Deny that and you would be lying.
And since Serbs had such great experience with NDH the only thing for them to do was to break lose.
About a certain person who was stating Milosevic hasn't won any war till now. He was the winner of the war in Bosnia ( even if that wasn't his war ).
There were only 30 % Serbs in Bosnia, after Dayton Serbs have 51 % of what was once a Bosnian teritory. Srpska republika will be a part of Serbia in ten years to come. That is well know. Now they enjoy the money the world is paying to rebuild their infrastructure. When that is done, they will unite with Serbia.
A very prominet analyst said that bridges in Vojvodina have nothing to do with Kosovo. NATO wants to devide mostly Hungarian population parts from Serb parts in order to do the same that they did in Kosovo. Make Serbia even smaller.

And an appalling statement from Clinton today. Commenting on the shooting in Colorado he said:
We should teach our young to solve problems with words, not arms. Great mister Clinton, more do as I say don't do as I do policy.


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 mate
(@mate)
New Member
Joined: 13 years ago
Posts: 4
April 21, 1999 6:43 pm  

Maja,

Croatia accepted the Vance Plan to give Serbs autonomy, for starters, so we did offer some form of autonomy.

You assume apriori that all Croatians were bent on killing Serbs. You say that we would magically achieve this, arms or no arms.

You ignore the fact that Serbian forces attacked 1st, unlike the Albanians of Kosovo.

You ignore the real crimes that Serbian forces committed against Croats, Muslims, and now Albanians.

You can only justify Serbian organized atrocities on the pretext of killing before being killed. Imagine what kind of world we would have if everyone killed on the basis of suspicion?

In the end, it came down to a contest of wills in Croatia to break an impasse. We managed to have more. It will happen for sure in this Kosovo situation.

You are an apologist in denial, that is all that I can say. You echo victim propaganda. In the end, it seems like the majority of bodies being buried are non-Serbian.

Mate


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