american people can ask them self:
is kosovo worth dying for?
if the answer is no, than stay out, and say NO!!
it is clear that serbs will not surender,
bombs can not solve anything, it is sad that
people have learn nothing during the history.
This can very well be 3.world war, think about
that..... and do something about it now!
demonstrate have civilian courage, dont belive politicans, they have lie to us before, and they
are doing that again.. just try to stop the war what ever it takes to do that.

Very popular words these days were "ethnical cleansing", "genocide" and such. Let me quote a person who can hardly be a Serbian. Or even pro-Serbian, as you can see from the rest of interview as well (I added a link).


> Transcript from March 24, 1999
>
> Timehost: Welcome to the TIME room! Our topic tonight is the NATO attack on
> Yugoslavia and our guest is Carnes Lord, a professor of American foreign
> policy and national security policy at Tufts University's Fletcher School
> of Law and Diplomacy, and a former assistant on national security affairs
> to Vice President Dan Quayle. Welcome, Prof. Lord.
>
> Professor Carnes Lord: Happy to be with you tonight.
>
> Timehost: Let's go to our first question.
>
> (etc. etc...)
>
>
> toniterror asks: Human rights are violated in Kosovo, but also in China.
> Why does NATP not bomb them?
>
> Carnes Lord: Yes. (Smiles). It's a question I've asked myself. The three
> objectives that the President has spoken about -- deterring the Serbs from
> escalating the violence, maintaining the credibility of NATO, and
> preventing the risk of a wider war in the region -- of all these, the most
> immediate is the humanitarian issue. However, I think there is a serious
> question as to the gravity of the humanitarian problem, compared with other
> like cases, like China. Or Turkey, to take the case of an American ally.
> The President said a few days ago in response to a question that the figure
> of 40 dead, of Kosovars killed by Serbian forces, reached the threshold of
> alliance intervention. Well, that's a pretty low threshold. That's not to
> say that it's not deplorable, but doesn't this create a precedent for a for
> a rather open-ended humanitarian intervention? There's been a lot of talk
> about genocide in Kosovo, but there's a big difference, for example,
> between the genocide in Germany in World War II, or in Cambodia in the
> 1970s on the one hand, and Kosovo on the other. These are not comparable
> situations. To call it genocide is to devalue those other experiences. It
> would be one thing if the Yugoslavs were systematically trying to kill
> every Kosovar in their way, but that doesn't seem to be their strategy. In
> addition, the fact is that there is an armed resistance movement that they
> claim to be fighting -- and are fighting -- which allows them to claim that
> civilian casualtites are incidental to the campaign against the Kosovo
> Liberation Army. Now you don't have to accept those claims exactly to view
> the situation differently than you would in a case of classic genocide. I
> think there's been an unwillingness on the part of NATO and the US to
> define the humanitarian problem in a sufficiently precise way that lays
> down a reasonable standard for humanitarian interventions in the future.
>
> etc.

It can be found somewhere in "Chat room", probably in older chats, on
http://www.time.com


...and to find about professor there's
http://www.tufts.edu/fletcher/staff/clord/


There's another interesting letter. Please read carefully lines quoted with >>>. If you'll like, it would be my pleasure to directly compare other statements of two appreciated gentlemen...


> Thank you for contacting me. I appreciate knowing of your
> concerns about the situation in Kosovo.
>
> As you know, President Clinton has ordered U.S. Armed Forces to
> participate in NATO air operations and missile strikes against the
> Federal Republic of Yugoslavia (Serbia and Montenegro). I was among
> the majority of U.S. Senators voting to authorize this action. The
> use of our Armed Forces is a decision I never take lightly, but I
> believe that NATO air and missile strikes against Serbian forces are
> necessary.
>
>
>>> This action is without doubt in our national interest.
>>>
>>> America's credibility and the future of the NATO alliance are on
>>> the line. We previously threatened to use force to prevent atrocities
>>> in Kosovo during the Bush Administration. If we fail to act, our threats
>>> in other parts of the world will not be taken seriously, and we may find
>>> ourselves having to actually use force more often.
>>>
>>> The United States, as the world's sole superpower, has a
>>> responsibility to stop Serbian police and military forces from
>>> continuing their genocidal attacks on Kosovar civilians. Slobodan
>>> Milosevic's forces are killing innocent people and driving them from
>>> their homes on the basis of their ethnicity -- they are committing
>>> genocide. We have an obligation and a responsibility to act to stop
>>> genocide.
>
> It is also important that we act now to prevent this conflict
> from spreading. We need to stop the Kosovo conflict before it draws
> other nations into a wider war -- we've already fought two world wars
> this century which began in the Balkans.
>
> Again, I appreciate having your views on this important issue.
> You can be sure I'll keep your views in mind as I continue to monitor
> events in Kosovo.
>
>
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Frank R. Lautenberg
> United States Senate
>

This will be my last post here!
I an second generation Czech but an American, I quit my good paying job today to go back into the Army and join my Airborne/Ranger unit, I just can't sit and watch the looks on the faces of the children and old peoples that have been forced out of Kosovo.It makes me sick.
I an not against the Serbian people, or the people of any country only the leaders that support these brutal crimes against humanity.

The propaganda coming from the US government is all too familiar to those Americans of the Vietnam generation. We heard how the freedom loving people of Vietnam were being abused by the evil reign of the Communists in the North. It was up to us to go and save them and protect their human rights. By the time the US left Vietnam we had devistated their country and lost a lot of young men on both sides as well as a lot of their civilian population, but we hadn't won- no one won- there is no winning in war. First we sent in " advisors" then the advisors were fired at so we sent in the planes, then we were told we had to send in the troops 'cause what would it look like if the US lost to the little country of Vietnam. Our young men went to die over there in the swamps thinking they were going to make a democracy. I remember my friends leaving in their uniforms all proud to be going to help, and I remember that a lot of them came back ashamed to talk about the things they had been forced to do. I also remember the one who didn't come back and the one who came back never able to walk again. It is time for NATO to stop the bombing before we "help" the people of the Balkans any more.
Human rights aren't won with weapons, they are won with speech, ideas and the courage to die as a martyr rather than kill another human being or back down from what you believe. The people of Kosovo and Serbia have such people in their country, Sasa Mirkovic, Ibrahim Rugova to name a couple of them. They need to have the courage to follow them. The people of Serbia and Kosovo need to stand up with one voice together and say that they will not kill for leaders whose only thoughts are their own personal political ambitions.

Caroline,
You are right, we shouldn't have helped in WW l or WW 2 either, we shouldn't have been in Korea, we shouldn't send aid to other countries. Can you imagine what a better place the world would be today if everyone felt that way?
There is more to the big picture than what you see in your little mind. The bible says there will always be war or rumors of war.

To all pro-Serb (= anti bombing) creeps.

Go to the Kosovo Crisis Center's web-page
and see for yourself the volumes of
COLOR PICTURES taken by humanitarian
agencies before the USA forced NATO's hand.

Childeren with their heads bashed.
Women who were raped before being killed.
Elderly with their eyes pulled out.
Men , decapitated.
Families burned.
All this from before the bombing started.

Even if the bombing does not stop the genocide
Even if Slob retains Kosovo.
One must take comfort in the fact
that the crimes are well documented
Slob Milo will pay - sooner or later.

But I am very worried about people
who rather not "get involved" in
NATO's attempt to stop Milosovic's
'final solution'.

YES - Send in the troops.
But send EUROPEAN ground forces.
(Please not the Dutch Srebrenica heroes !!)

Does NATO exist?
Where are the EURO-Boys ?
The French, Germans and Italians are
too busy with the EURO.

Do Americans have to save Europe - AGAIN ?
Cowards.

Dan,
Are you under the illusion that we entered World Wars I& II to protect human rights? We got into those wars because of selfish interests. In World War I we got into it because the Germans kept attacking our ships that were taking arms to the French and the British. In World War II we got into it because the Japanese bombed our naval base. Then we put Japanese Americans on the west coast and Hawaii in concentration camps. Some of the people in the camps even had sons and husbands fighting in our army.
I am all for sending economic aid, education, humanitarian aid, and any aid but military aid. The Bible says, " Thou shalt not kill." Jesus did more for human rights by his teaching and his maryrdom than all the armies in the world. The only thing we have done with wars is make hatred and divison, and pretend to do it in God's name.
If we were true followers of Christ, we would die ourselves rather than kill our brothers and sisters. We would follow the examples of Jesus and the early Christians. When Peter pulled out his sword, Jesus told him to put it away. The disciples didn't go out and form an army after his death. They went out to spread the love of God to
others knowing that they would die as martyrs in the process. Helping the people of Kosovo and Serbia kill each other will not bring peace and love into the world. We are certainly ready to jump into the fight when it is is someone else's country we are blowing up.

Im a Bosnian Female who had to go to Holland ,cause she tryed to wake people before war started in Bosnia. I ended up in prison i still see up till today what they done to me.My husband and 3 children died before reaching Holland. So i talk from experience.
Anyone who still DOUBT about question should you sent help(groundtroops) is for my feeling GRAZY!

In Kosovo same happens as what happened in Bosnia only MOST people9NATO and civillian) dont want to open their eyes.

Ask yourself if your country would need assistance, and you do not get it.What do you do?How do you feel?Where do you go?
Would you cry for help?

Its very easy said fight yourself,but not easy done i know still, and my whole life i will know when i look in mirror!

Conclusion: Yes ofcourse groundtroops need to be sent only pitty nobody have realized this earlyer, so many suffering would not have happened in first place!
DOES NOBODY SEE THAT MILOSEVIC = HITLER NUMER 3?
IF YOU CALL IT GREAT SERBIA OR HEIM INS REICH ITS THE SAME!

Past wars are irrelevant as are any hidden political or economic motivations that NATO countries may have (paranoid conspiracy theorists love to think so). Forget all that.

Just think about the anihilation TODAY of innocent elderly men and women, and the ruthless killing of childeren. How can anybody be against fighting this Balkan Hitler ?

Within a few weeks there will be no more Albanians in Kosovo. Milosovic will then offer peace and propose elections ! Idiots like you will jump at the chance and say : "see, he is not a bad guy after all".

With your support he will then turn to Montenegro and continue the rampage. Rape, kill, pillage and burn.

Bomb Belgrade every hour on the hour. Even if the bombs don't win the war, at least we punish these bastards, run them into underground bunkers and make them all live like dogs, just like they do to others. Maybe not a big achievement, but it is 100% more than what you suggest.

You are of the kind that will not lift a hand for people in need because you don't know them personally and thus it is not your business. But then you turn and you quote the Bible !!!!!

PLEASE ! You and Milosovic give the Bible and Christians a bad name !

I am not against fighting Milosovic, I'm just against bombing the hell out of the people of Serbia. We aren't hurting Milosovic by killing the Serbian people. If we spill enough of their blood do you think he will throw in the towel and say stop the killing? Hitler would have let all of the people of Germany die before he gave up.
If we really want to get rid of him, accuse him of war crimes and put the money we are spending on bombs as a reward for his capture and the capture of the tiger troops that support him.
If we do send in ground troops, then the end objective should be the take over of Serbia, Bosnia, and Kosovo and NATO occupation of the country to stop ethnic violence on the part of all of the people in that region. What I see is another Vietnam. We attack them, but our troops are only allowed to go so far which leaves the Serbian people in his hands and leads to terrorism by both the Serb thugs and the KLA thugs in Kosovo while we have troops in there that will never be able to leave and a situation like Iraq,and Korea or worst of all Vietnam. Meanwhile the people of Sebia are still subject to human rights violations at his hands.
If we try to take Serbia, that will bring in the Russians because we are attacking a soverign country with an attempt to take it over. Are you ready for a world war? If we kill off most of the world to fight for human rights in Kosovo, will that satisfy you? When the governments, in nearby countries become involved and their women and children die, will you talk about how great it is that we are giving the people in this area their human rights and stopping the killing of innocent women and children and elderly people?

>

You're laughable Sergey. Who would stop us? Russians? You cant even control a bunch of peasants with hunting rifles in Chechnya, and you want to spout about how all the world knows American soldiers cant fight? How would you get your troops to Yugoslavia? You cant pay them without IMF money, now can you Sergey. Thats American dollars keeping your bankrupt nation afloat, and Mr. Yeltsin and Primakov know it. And the Chinese wont do anything because they know the hole your country is in. And the Chinese have never acted without Russia patting them on the head. Korea you say? I believe those were Russian pilots in Russian MiGs over Korea. You and your countrymen can bluster all you want, you are in no position to do anything. Hot air, Sergey, you and your Russian comrades are all Hot Air. If American soldiers cant fight without electronic gadgets, Russian soldiers cant fight period, and the only threat you hold over Europe and the US is your crumbling nuclear arsenal, what hasnt been sold off that is.

There wont be a world war Caroline, because Russia is bankrupt and the Chinese have too much to lose and no means of projecting power. The best Russia can do is send "volunteers."

What would you suggest we do? Love Mr. Milosevich to death? Thats called appeasement Caroline, a certain Prime Minister named Chamberlain tried that in the 1930's to utter global disaster. Try him for war crimes, put a price on his head? And how are we to get him to the Hague for this trial? Bounties dont work, a certain Salman Rushdie had the entire Muslim world against him and last I checked he was openly going to Operas in the UK and appearing on certain American late night Talk Shows... What if we do manage to get rid of him? Do you think that he's working in a vacuum? There are ten more Milosevich's waiting behind him. There is a time for diplomacy Caroline, but diplomacy works only if both parties deliberate in good faith. While the world was attempting diplomacy, Milo was continuing his murderous escapades. When diplomacy fails, war begins. Or it is rather, war is an extension of diplomacy when talking has failed. You cant turn the other cheek Caroline, to do so makes ones hands all the more bloody.

PS: Roosevelt used Japan as a "backdoor to war" precisely to stop Hitler and what was going on in Germany and Poland.

By Maja on Friday, April 2, 1999 - 12:44 am:

Bob and all the others. Nobody has forced anybody from my country. I live in Slovenia.
As for everything else, read my other postings.

Maja, I regret what has and is about to happen to your country. However, there are many who have been driven from their homes into refugee camps at the neighboring borders. There are also many who are reported to have been taken away from their families and no one knows what happened to them. Innocent people are dying in those refugee camps because the hosting countries are unable to provide them with the basic necessities to live right now.

Such actions are unacceptable to the those nations who belong to NATO and have to stop. Right now there are only two possible outcomes. Either Malosovic agrees to stop what he is doing and agrees to allow the refugee's to return and live in peace or we will have to do whatever is necessary to stop the human suffering. Nato has no real interest in taking over your country because,quite frankly, you have nothing that they want other than peace in your region of the world.

Right now, the eventual outcome of the conflict is in Malosovic's hands. Unfortunately, he seems to be bent on making the wrong decisions based on his own prejudices against an entire race of people. Also unfortunately, it is the military and civilian populations that will actually pay the price for his decisions as we will pay the price for our politican's decisions.

Sometimes the price for freedom and peace is very high indeed. It is a price that we as a country are willing to pay. However, feel assured that once the commitment of ground troops are started we will achieve the military objective that we set out to do.

Let's agree :

1. There is NO EXCUSE for GENOCIDE.

2. There will NOT be a World War. Derek is right as it regards Russian involvement. Sorry to say Sergey, Russia is more concerned about capitalist realities than ideological dreams. Personally I think the Russian navy is comming to the region to fetch some food from the relief agencies for themselves.

3. NATO is not killing Serbs Caroline. NATO is blasting big holes in buildings and bridges used by Serbs to kill people in Kosovo. Except, of course the very brave forces in Kosovo that are doing the killing.

4. Send in ground troops to protect enclaves. Preferably EURO-guys and Slavs. Americans are too easy to use for propaganda purposes.

5. MOST IMPORTANT : INVESTIGATE ALL WAR CRIMES AND EXHIBIT THE PICTURES TO THE PEOPLE IN BELGRADE. Parade their delegations through the killing fields like the Germans had to do in 1945. It is conceivable that in 1945 German civilians were unaware of the existance concentration camps. Today, however, the world knows they are there.